Greek Certainties: Death, Taxes and Tax Evaders



"I'm moving to Greece. I won't have to pay any taxes at all!"
“I’m moving to Greece. I won’t have to pay any taxes at all!”

Raising taxes is supposed to be antithetical to Republicans and Greece’s New Democracy Capitalists who usually pin that on Democrats and the Left.

But it wasn’t surprising when, instead of going after tax evaders who owe their beloved country $70 billion but hide their money in secret bank accounts in Switzerland, Singapore, Luxembourg, Lichtenstein, the Cayman Islands and other tax cheat havens around the world, Prime Minister Antonis Samaras decided to tax the middle class – and some businesses too – into near-extinction.

Breaking yet another vow, this one to defend the middle class of Greece under siege for nearly three years with pay cuts, tax hikes and slashed pensions, the wobbly coalition government led by Samaras’ New Democracy party pushed through Parliament a tax “reform” bill that assesses a rate of 42 percent on those earning 42,000 euros ($56,000) and raises the corporate tax rate from 20 to 26 percent.

The Wall Street Journal, the favored reading of Republicans, Conservatives and Samaras defenders, dubbed it “tax insanity,” so it will be curious to see what the Samaras lovers say about this one as their guy sold them down the river too. They’ll say he was forced to do so by Greece’s international lenders, the Troika of the European Union-International Monetary Fund-European Central Bank (EU-IMF-ECB) so that Greece could keep getting money to prop up an economy destroyed by alternating administrations of New Democracy and the PASOK Socialists, so there’s plenty of blame on the left and the right.

New Democracy’s philosophy is much like American Republicans whose motto is “Deliver the mail, defend the shores and stay the hell out of our lives,” and both are anti-tax and pro-business, so when did Samaras become a Leftist and become pro-tax and anti-business? He’ll come to find, as Shakespeare wrote, that, “Politics is a thieves game and those who stay in it long enough are bound to be robbed,” but for now he’s robbing not just the middle class – the people who consume, buy white goods and appliances and electronics and all the stuff sold by rich companies who need customers – but the businesses too.

There’s another delicious loophole in the new tax code. Only late in December, 2012, after changing its position more often that Weathervane Samaras does did Greek tax officials warn taxpayers that unless they produce receipts equivalent to 25 percent of their income that they could face a 22 percent surtax on the difference.

That brings the effective tax rate for many in the middle-class to 64 percent, which might seem sweet if you live in France where Crazed Leftist Francois Hollande wants to tax people who earned their wealth at 75 percent, but for many Greeks it’s an economic death sentence because that’s just the income tax and they have to pay a doubled property tax and now electric bills are going up 15 percent, except for government agencies who don’t have to pay their bills and pass them on to actual taxpayers.

Maybe Samaras can give Greek citizenship to Gerard Depardieu, who’s seeking Russian citizenship to escape France’s lunatic tax rates. The Greek leader can have a poster boy and boast that Greece’s tax rate is at least lower than France’s. Because Depardieu is rich and famous he can play cards with politicians and the fellow rich and discover he can pay no taxes at all! But he’d better get it in writing because Samaras’ promises aren’t worth the drachmas on which they’re written.

Samaras you may remember was opposed to austerity before he supported it then opposed it then supported it and is also the guy who promised small bondholders who got stiffed in the Greek debt write-down that he would get their money back then forgot they existed.

MR. TAXMAN IS COMING

Taxes are needed in a civilized country so the mail can be delivered, the shores defended, and to provide schools, hospitals, roads and services that people need, but there is a law of diminishing returns too as the austerity measures Samaras loves so much have shown. Don’t take my word for it. Olivier Blanchard, the chief economist at the International Monetary Fund – an agency to the right of John Birch – said the austerity measures it demanded in return for joining with the European Union and European Central Bank to bail out Greece have backfired.

That’s what economists never learn because they learn Economics as undergraduates, graduate students and get their doctorates but most have undoubtedly never had to balance a checkbook or leave a classroom to see what’s going on in the street. But you don’t have to go to the London School of Economics or Harvard Business School to know that when you cut people’s pay at the same time you are raising taxes that the two eventually meet and you have a zero net gain – or even a loss.

That’s been proved by the great equalizer: math. Greek tax revenues are far off projections because the government keeps imposing austerity without raising revenues from other sources, such as Foreign Direct Investment, which the IMF said fell by some 60 percent from 2008 – the year before former PASOK Socialist leader and then Prime Minister George Papandreou went begging for loans – to 2010, when it was only 0.32 percent of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) and sliding.

In competitiveness, the World Economic Forum (WEF) for 2012-13 lists Greece at 96th, behind the likes of Mongolia, Namibia, Albania, Moldova, FYROM, Botswana, Romania, Vietnam, Sri Lanka, Bulgaria, Chile, Iceland, and Brunei. So what’s Greece’s motto for attracting business: “Hey, We’re ahead of Tajikistan!”

At the same time, Transparency International says Greece is the most corrupt country in Europe, even worse than Italy, where the Mafia runs almost everything. And if you want to attract business, you need educational institutions that are better than correspondence courses off matchbox covers, which many of Greece’s universities amount to, according to World University Rankings which listed only one – the University of Crete – far down in the list of the top 400.

Since the austerity insanity began (if Papandreou had fired 150,000 workers three years ago and put them in training to be hired by private companies that Greece could have lured with lower tax rates and collected overdue taxes none of this would have been necessary) Greece’s debt has gone from 120 percent of GDP to 190 percent. Maybe an economics major can say if that’s good or not.

ECONOMIC EXODUS

Meanwhile, Greece’s largest company, Coca-Cola Hellenic, tired of tax increases and as greedy as a New Democracy Conservative but not as lazy as a Leftist loony, is leaving Athens for the tax haven of Switzerland where it will find plenty of company with Greeks hiding money in banks there.

The patriots of Fage, one of the major players in Greek dairy cartels that charges more for yogurt in Greece than in some other countries where it distributes, are leaving Athens for Luxembourg, and the new tax plan will have the moving vans backed up at more companies in Greece, joining the thousands moving to other countries, including Bulgaria, where the tax rate on businesses and on income is a flat 10 percent. Maybe Samaras’ economic advisors can calculate if that’s higher than 26 and 42 percent on Greek income and businesses.

Coca-Cola’s departure has cut the value of equities listed in Athens to about $31 billion from $39.2 billion, according to Bloomberg, making it smaller than ….. Vietnam. It also makes Greece the smallest among 24 developed markets traced by the agency, and there’s one major reason why: taxes.  While Greece’s economy is shrinking by about 4.5 percent of GDP, Bulgaria’s is growing by about 1.5 percent. Worse for Greece, Turkey – where the income tax rate is still 20 percent – is expecting 4 percent growth.

The Journal wrote that, “We keep hearing that Greece needs to make its economy more competitive, which is true. But it won’t do that by making its tax code more punitive. Greece needs to break out of the EU-IMF austerity trap,” recommending a flat tax rate.

That can be regressive and counter-productive but one formula the economic whizzes surrounding Samaras haven’t used yet is collecting taxes that are due. Until that’s done, Greece will continue to rue what 19th Century American Supreme Court Chief Justice John Marshall wrote long before income taxes: “The power to tax is the power to destroy.”


46 COMMENTS

  1. Andy Dablis of the USA once against pawning his leftist rhetoric as “news”.

    Lets check some of Dablis’s buzarre “facts”

    1. “Minister Antonis Samaras decided to tax the middle class – and some businesses too – into near-extinction”

    Actually it wasn’t Samaras that wanted to raise taxes. It was the EU/IMF that demanded it in exchange for bail out loans No raised taxes. No loans to pay pensioners, government workers, and services that you keep ranting that you support.

    Got that comrade Andy?

    If you want to complain, complain to your fellow leftists at the New York Times and Guardian that are always whining for more services and  asking to raise taxes to pay for those services.  Complain to your fellow leftist in the EU  that want to raise taxes in Greece rather than share their own wealth to pay down Greece’s debt.

    Did you expect a free lunch Dablis?

    2. “That’s been proved by the great equalizer: math. Greek tax revenues are
    far off projections because the government keeps imposing austerity
    without raising revenues from other sources,””

    Nonsense. Revenue is off because of job loses and a shrivelling economy. Austarity was necessary to balance books. The blame for our shriviling economy is to be found in prior overspending and bloated governments, not in trying to match spending to revenue.

    The EU and others do not wish to fund the lifestyle of our leftist welfare queens (including your fellow leftists in other countries that claim to support you… then whine when their governments sent bail out loans to Greece)

    3 “Meanwhile, Greece’s largest company, Coca-Cola Hellenic, tired of tax
    increases and as greedy as a New Democracy Conservative but not as lazy
    as a Leftist loony”

    You represent leftist looney. You pretend you are somehow above left and right… then go on and rant and rant every day about the “greedy” rich and how the poor are all victims …EXACTLY like commies like Syriza do. 

    Where are your all articles in support of our businesses rather than handouts like the communist parasites do comrade Andy? All I hear is you ranting against  businesses like communists do. How exactly are we supposed to create wealth if you focus on Pol Pot sounding speechs about “the “people’… rather than helping our busineses that feed those people?

    On a practically level…. who do your endless anti-government rants help but communist’s like Syriza?

  2. Trivia of the day: the majority of tax cheats appear to be Greeks that vote left and claim to be “against corruption”. Catching tax cheats (whether rich or poor) definitely needs to be done but this cannot be done overnight as our leftist fanatics seem to believe. However even if we catch all our tax cheats this does not equal high quality of life and end of austarity. All austarity represents is what our real production as a nation (rather than accounting trickery and living off credit)

    And out production as a nation is pityful

    Samaras is in no way to blame for decades of rot he inherited. He just
    became PM and already he is making massive changes where everyone else
    did nothing. No amount of socialist money redistribution scams can change our quality of life. If we want to improve our quality of life we have to stop depending on handouts from they wealthy or the government. We each have to start taking personally responsibility to make sure that we each do our own part to not burden anyone else.  To be human beings that work hard to produce things that improve the world (rather than lazy sponges that whine how everyone else owes us money)

    Lets get something straight here .

    The rich and powerful are not perfect but they are certainly not to blame for the actions of lazy incompetent poor people that vote for communist freeloaders like Syriza. Poverty is not a badge of “victimhood”.  Poor people themselves also hold moral responsibility for their bad life choices that either made them poor or kept them poor. 

    To “the poor” Andy whines about… stop listening to these leftist fanatics trying to turn you all into  “victims”. Take control of your lives. Be proud in your own accomplishments. Think not what you can take from others in handouts but what you can produce in fair trade.

  3.  Blah, blah, blah, and more blah… 

    If it’s not the Skopia/FYROM/Syriza sucks issue, it’s
    the ‘Everyone who disagrees with me is a leftist wanker’ crap.  It would
    be nice if just occasionally you were able to play a different tune
    instead of boring us all with the same pointless ‘I know it all’ drivel you love spewing up.

    Your constant recourse to meaningless generalities doesn’t help either.  Instead of imploring others to take control of their lives you might want to rethink yours and come up with an original thought rather than reheat yesterday’s leftovers that you took out of the trash.

    Andy Dablis may not be the world’s greatest journalist, but he is certainly a hundred times better than you judge him to be.  At least *he* gets paid for his writing.  Can you boast such a claim?  If he is so damned awful, why do you bother to read him, let alone constantly expend time and energy bothering to comment on how wrong and terrible he is? 

    It’s easy to attack and criticize as you do when you know full well Dablis is unable to respond openly to your comments, isn’t it?

  4. After reading the above article Greece has absolutely no hope.And we are in trouble as a country.. Is there any good news ??or any hope for Greece???
     

  5.  Blah blah blah… more leftist whining. Complain without explaining what I am saying wrong. Pathetic.

    Andy Dablis is a fanatic that keep ranting about the government and “the poor” like any commie on Syriza. I don’t care that he gets paid. Communists, Nazis and religious fanatics get paid to write articles too. What matters is what people say not that they are paid.

    While he pretends to be a “patriot” I have observed he also writes articles for US MILTARY FUNDED setimes.com (that calls FYROM “Macedonians” and pretends not to notice the Skopians sudden change into ancient Macedonia). I write for love of Greece not for money.

    No one stops Andy from replying to comments as you bizarrely claim. He chooses not to reply. Andy likes to liberally dish it out to everyone else but doesn’t like to be the target.

  6.  There is hope… if we each focus on production.

    If we instead are out on the streets throwing rocks at other Greeks,… begging for handouts from other Greeks…. whining about how rich and government are to blame for all our ills like freeloaders like communist Syriza and anarchists do… then we will go nowhere.

    The bottom line is if we want wealth we as individuals need to create it.  Waiting around for government handouts is the surest path to failure.

  7.  Blah, blah, blah again Alex.

    For one thing, just because I abhor your whining and repetitive rhetoric does not mean I am a leftist.  (And all because I disagree with you?!)

    As a businessman in Athens, I and along with many many others are seeing our livelihoods being constantly dwindled away by successive incompetent governments.  You say, “if we want wealth we as individuals need to create it.”  Okay….  What do you suppose struggling and defunct businesses have been trying to do all this time?  The whole purpose of being self-employed and running a company is to make money, right?  How does that make me personally a leftist?

    I am not a leftist!!!!

    I can’t speak for others but I for one pay my taxes, give receipts, pay my employees’ etc., all according to ever changing policies and tax reforms every five minutes that seem determined to screw me and everyone else who is self-employed in this country. 

    And I suppose you will accuse me of whinging next?  Given, I still have my head above water and food on the table, and compared to some I have no right to complain, but the truth is my business has shrunk 50% in the last year and I have had to fire some employees to stay afloat. (I am grateful for the respite but not at all for putting people out of work.)  And all a result of government policies and the fact I am not a “tax cheat” as you so eloquently put it.

    It is quite obvious that government policies introduced to deal with the crisis have not worked.  More austerity does not work.  I DO blame the government.  More production is impossible if your business is imploding.  Even someone as blinkered as you at times must surely see that.  I AM producing in fair trade and obeying the law.  And yet I am undergoing the equivalent of having to bend over and be well and truly shafted by Samaras and all those other reptiles in government.

    And for the record, no, I do not think throwing rocks is the answer either.  Whilst revolutions can be wonderfully emancipating, a lot of people get hurt before the dust settles and life improves.  (Although a few places on the guillotine for some of our esteemed politicians wouldn’t be so bad I think.)

    The answer?  I am no economist, but even a child at *Demotiko* can grasp the fact that increased austerity and high taxation does not work.  Doing an about turn on that would be a start.

  8. All you ever blame is the “communist Syriza and anarchists” for problems of Greece.  The people who need government assistance deserve the help.  The tax evading rich deserve jail.  The corrupt politicians deserve jail as well.  The whole of Greece followed the lead of the leaders.  If they aren’t paying why should I pay?  You or your family at some point have been adversely affected by what the communists did back in the 40’s.  These aren’t the same people.  You would at least sound more objective in your arguments if you leave out the hatred.

  9.  Lying leftist troll.  I have stated many times I also place blame in other parties too. I have also stated many times that if someone doesn’t like the current parties I have no issue with them supporting or creating some other middle ground party.

    However, I would take any of the middle of the ground parties any day of the week over ranting incompetent communist and anarchist fanatics. Different does not always mean better comrade. (see North Korea)

    Any tax evading poor that abuse services also deserve to be in jail.
    Those that tax evade in the middle class and abuse government services
    also deserve to jail you parastic class warfare self-righteous nitwit.

    As for hate… leftists like you seem to hate pretty much anyone that isn’t poor or leftist. Rather than by disgusted by communists and anarchists you apologize for them. This is an inversion of morally. You should be ashamed of yourself.

  10. Who are you trying to kid comrade?

    If you were right on the political spectrum you would hardly be “offended’ by me slamming anti-government leftist whiners.

    You ask “What do you suppose struggling and defunct businesses have been trying to do all this time?”

    Are business people are trying to create wealth. Meanwhile our disruptive unions (mostly leftists) are constantly striking and rioting. Our government is still too bloated to be business friendly (too many laws and too many workers) Unfortunately when it tries to make cuts we have communists and anarchits extremists out on the streets rioting against the very businesses that feed them and parasitically demanding handouts.

    Like a typically leftist you talk about “austarity not working” as if it is a choice.

    All austarity is about is finally balancing our budgets comrade.  Our national credit cards have been revoked and we are on EU/IMF life support to pay our bills. In exchange for foreign taxpayers and creditors injecting BILLIONS into our economy (because we screwed up) they expect us to live in our means. We are not entitled to live like Germans or Americans because we do not produce like them comrade. Welcome to the real world.

    Who exactly do you expect to pay our bills? Are communist and anarchist thieves going to do it by stealing all the wealth of our producers? What happens then when no one wants to do business with our communist thieves out of fear they will nationalize everything? What incentive do our business people have to work hard if leftist welfare queens are going to rob them of their wealth?

  11. More “deep” comments by another leftist whiner.

    Why not for a change point to the line where what I say is in error dear?

  12.  Rather than be thinking about how to patriotically help Greece by not burdening our government  in time of crisis (byhelping it as much as we can)…. or parasitic “anti-nationalist” leftists whiners can only think about themselves..

    All they talk about is getting handouts and whining about taxes they have to pay for those handouts. You can’t have your cake and eat it too comrade. If you want services you have to pay for them.

  13. To any alleged moderate leftists…

    Until communist Syriza fanatics are demoted into a crackpot status with less than 1% of vote (where they belong along with Nazis and religious extremists)…. rather than the possibility of winning an election…. you should be SLAMMING them just like you do GD (that I would note represent a far far smaller demographic than Syriza). Far leftist extremism is a far far bigger problem that GD in Greece these days. Most of the terrorist violence, riots, and destruction of public property is due to leftist extremists.

    If you are not slamming these anti-hellenic leftist extremists and anarchits….and instead defending them or whitewashing their bizarre attempts to once again spread a failed oppressive systems… it suggests you are are sympathetic to their extremism.

    To any Greek patriots (whether moderate left or right)…

    Now is the time to support our coalition government. We need political stability not ranting extremists out through firebombs and calling for violent revolution. If we don’t support our coalition government…communist extremists are waiting in the wings to destroy our homeland.

    Aside from destroying our economy (making our economy today look like its booming)… they can be trusted to slowly delete our very identity by collaberating with IMRO exactly like they did during Greek civil war. Most communists primary alligiance is to their communist ideology not to the Greek people themselves. If push came to shove many of them would murder us for their ideology and foreign “comrades” just like they did during Greek civil war. We have to learn from history not repeat it.
    .

  14. “If they aren’t paying why should I pay? ”

    Typically idiocy of a leftist.

    You should pay because its supposedly your own principles no? Aren’t you leftists the one’s always calling for more services and higher taxes? What you hypocritical freeloaders really mean though is you want OTHERS to pay for you.  This is why you rant on and on about the rich and treat the poor as all “victims” (as if the poor carry no moral responsibility for their own lives and own lazy incompetence either lead them to be poor or kept them poor)

    My mother started off as poor champ.  She was abandoned by my lazy deadbeat father with her chldren and next to no money. Rather than rant for handouts from the government or blame the rich… she worked hard her whole life to make a better life for herself and her family. Sometimes she got paid peanuts but she kept plugging away morning to night with virtually no help from anyone. We were never rich but she made sure we had food on our table, clothes on our back, a roof over our heads, and an opportunity to further ourselves with an education.

    So don’t tell me the rich, the banks, the illuminati are all to blame for all your personal ills you self-righteous parasitic whiner.  Don’t tell me anarchists and communists have anything to do with reason, morality, or democracy.

    For those  willing to work hard to do so there is always hope. What the rich are doing, what our government is doing, what the fairy princes are doing…. to justify their own poverty…. is for excuse makers looking to leach off the backs of others.  If someone wants to give to someone else its noble… but it should be taken from them by a mob of incompetent lazy communist sheep.

  15.  “If they aren’t paying why should I pay? ”

    Typically idiocy of a leftist.

    You should pay because its supposedly your own principles no? Aren’t
    you leftists the one’s always calling for more services and higher
    taxes? What you hypocritical freeloaders really mean though is you want
    OTHERS to pay for you.  This is why you rant on and on about the rich
    and treat the poor as all “victims” (as if the poor carry no moral
    responsibility for their own lives and own lazy incompetence either lead
    them to be poor or kept them poor)

    My mother started off as poor champ.  She was abandoned by my lazy
    deadbeat father with her chldren and next to no money. Rather than rant
    for handouts from the government or blame the rich… she worked hard
    her whole life to make a better life for herself and her family.
    Sometimes she got paid peanuts but she kept plugging away morning to
    night with virtually no help from anyone. We were never rich but she
    made sure we had food on our table, clothes on our back, a roof over our
    heads, and an opportunity to further ourselves with an education.

    So don’t tell me the rich, the banks, the illuminati are all to blame
    for all your personal ills you self-righteous parasitic whiner.  Don’t
    tell me anarchists and communists have anything to do with reason,
    morality, or democracy.

    For those  willing to work hard to do so there is always hope. What
    the rich are doing, what our government is doing, what the fairy princes
    are doing…. to justify their own poverty…. is for excuse makers
    looking to leach off the backs of others.  If someone wants to give to
    someone else its noble… but it shouldn’t  be taken from them by a mob of angry ranting
    incompetent lazy communist sheep.

  16. I find your argumentation petty, confusing, and, to be perfectly frank, idiotic and contradictory.  It would help if you actually paid attention to what people were saying when they were making the effort to reply to your comments.

    Sure business people are trying to make money.  That is, after all, the point of doing business.  So how does that make me a typical leftist?!  Like you I have no time for scroungers, but unlike you I possess compassion for those who have no choice but to seek government benefit because they have lost their job through the incompetence of successive governments mishandling the economy and looking after their own self interests. 

    What is more, if I am not mistaken, state benefit is limited to a year at most.  To receive it means you have to be eligible.  i.e., to have contributed beforehand via IKA or some other obligatory state insurance fund.  I do not speak of course for those illegally claiming deceased pensions or whatever.  I find such actions immoral and I cannot condone it.  However, would it were so black and white.  What about all those who would not manage at all without it?  What would you have them do?  Starve?  And if you had a family to support?  What then?

    I cannot say I understand your political position other than you hate anyone left of centre, but you seem to be a spokesperson for the ND.  Do you really believe Samaras and the rest of the clowns in the coalition.  Really think they are doing what is best for us as a nation?  That the Pasok, ND legacy is not responsible for the mess we are in.  The fish does indeed stink from the head.  Do you really think that all those rock throwing leftists/anarchists are what they seem to be and have nothing at all to do with the government?  You are sadly misguided, ignorant, and need to get a reality check.

  17. It is official Alex.  You DO suck. 

    Add to that the fact you are a patronizing, self-absorbed, obsessed arsehole who cannot formulate a logical argument and has to spew up the same nonsensical rhetoric, I would say you are working under a psuedonym and that you are really working for ND.

    Come on. Admit it Alex. You want to allow Samaras to take you in an unnatural way and thank him for it, don’t you?

  18. ad you not been a leftist you would not have been offended by constant criticism of the left comrade.

    You write “unlike you I possess compassion for those who have no choice but to seek government benefit ”

    i..e you are a leftist.

    Unlike you… I believe in voluntarily helping… rather than leftist thieves that frame their government backed thievery “giving”.

    No one… no one… is stoppng you from sharing your worldly possessions equally with the poor at this very moment comrade. As a typically leftist though… you hoard most of your wealth to yourself.

    What manipulative self-righteous leftist leaches like you mean by “giving”…
    is OTHER people having their property taken away by government force.  What you want is for others to fund you lazy parasitic thieves.

  19. I will take that as a compliment from someone that is sucha clueless moron they don’t even realize they are left on the political spectrum.

    Why are you here comrade? Shouldn’t you be out with your fellow leftist thugs throwing rocks and firebombs at the police? Should you be spraying gunfire at our elected government officials? Should you be out begging for handouts from our government while you lecture about “morals”?.

  20.  I support Samara because he is a patriot that cares about Greece…. unlike unpatriotic leftist whining parasites like you that can only think about how to leech off other Greeks. 

    Your entitlement attitude is exactly what is wrong with Greece today. Millions of leftist whiners who think someone else owes them a money or job. Always looking for the way to easy way to money by depending on someone else for it.  Its pathetic.

  21. Children sometimes need government help. The sick sometimes need help. However, for the most part very few people have “no choice but to seek government benefit”. They seek government benefit because they are seeking an easy route to wealth….at the expense of others.

    Consider some of the elderly that leftists like to treat as all “victims”  Didn’t they have a lifetime to generate wealth? They are all “victims’ because they decided they preferred to spend their money frivolously when they could have saved. They are “victims” for burdening the next generation so they can retire at 62 for the next 20 years at the expense of others? Did anyone stop them from putting money so as to not burden anyone else

    Most people have two arms no? Two legs? A brain? How it is some people don’t need to “seek government benefit”.. .whereas other fuilly functional people  have “no choice but to seek government benefit”?

    Do you think our own individual moral and intellectual character might have something to do with our status in life? Or is it usually the fault of someone else for our circumstances in life?

  22.  Blah, blah, blah…

    Here we go with the repetitive leftist bit again. Assuming you even read what I wrote above, how could I be possibly leeching off of of other Greeks? Your whole reply is contrary to everything I have said.

    And as for Samaras being a patriot, HA! How exactly did you reach that conclusion? What is patriotic about being a leader of a party (along with Pasok) that has completely sold Greece out and is to equally blame for the mess we are in now?

    He changes his face and political allegiance every time the wind blows. His actions that brought ND down in 1993 and his return when Political Spring crashed is typical of his about face attitude.  Or have you forgotten about that? His lack of party loyalty screwed ND totally. And what of his pre-election promise of no more austerity?

    That soon changed, didn’t it? And for all your anti-leftist talk, would you like to enlighten us as to how we are now better off under his leadership than we were before the last two last elections? Like you he is a great whiner too. His insistence on calling elections (all so he could run the country) meant two elections and we are worse off than before: GD in government, an unstable coalition, and greater austerity.

    It is confirmed. You have no idea what you are talking about.

  23. You are a leftist, Just because you are too much of a dumbass to realize it isn’t my problem.

    Samaras is a patriot. While Syriza treasonously collaberates with the Skopians and cares more about 3rd world illegals that disrespect our borders and laws… he sticks up for Greeks.

    He hasn’t “sold out Greece” you ungreatful moron. It is unpatriotic leftist whining parasites like you that have done that.

    If our coalition government doesn’t agree to austarity terms… no bail out funds. DO you understand that without bailout funds the austarity will be far far worse you moron? What do you think will happen the day the government and banks have no more money because of greedy incompentent ranting idiots like you that think you are entitled to someone else’s money?

    Furthermore why do you go on and on about the government in the first place? Can’t you survive without shameless sucking back government money you parastic low life?

    Please explain how exactly ou freeloaders are “helping”  our country…. by demanding from our government in a time of crushing debt?

    How are personally  helping by ranting about a coalition goverrnment that will only end up with COMMUNISTS in power?

    It is confirmed. You are a ranting leftist imbecile.

  24. “His lack of party loyalty screwed ND totally.”

     Samaras loyality is to his country not his party you unpatriotic sheep follower.

    If you really wanted to help Greece, you would focus on your own personal production,  get a fricken job, then pull money out of your own pocketbook  to help.

    Instead all you leftist whiners keep doing is ranting for handouts from our government while having the audacity to claim you “care”?

    Its a disgusting inversion of morality.

  25. Question here? Having come on this site for the first time, does anybody know if Alex actuallly answers other people or is he reallly just a CD stuck on a loop?

  26.  Blah, blah, blah…

    Samaras’s loyalty, like all those others responsible for getting us in this mess is for himself first before any thought for his country.  That is why he is a *true patriot*. (See below.)

    I know your lack of brain cells have a problem retaining information (that’s why you keep repeating yourself I suppose because even you cannot be that stupid), but I do have a job.  I said I was a self-employed businessman, remember?

    I actually employ people too, remember?

    This means I actually contribute to the economy. I completely abide by the law too, which means I am struggling to continue to have a business and employ people. (I am repeating this to help you as you are so  obviously mentally challenged).

    Do you contribute to the economy arsehole?

    Are you self-employed?

    Do you do your bit for your country except write these moronic comments out of love for your country? (Thought not.)

    And all because you are a *true patriot*.

    (There’s that phrase again. Wasn’t it mentioned at the beginning of this reply? Just helping you to remember because I suspect you have dementia. I’m not repeating myself because I have nothing new to say (unlike you) or do not read what others have taken the time to write in reply (like you again).

    So God bless Greece and Alex! He’s a *true patriot*!

    As Samuel Johnson once wisely said, “Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.” He meant that a despicable character uses patriotism as an excuse for justifying their immoral words and actions.

    Fits you, Alex. I’d also say it equally applies to those scoundrels in parliament who have sold us all out and lined their pockets at the same time. It’s very easy to say one has acted out of a love of their country, isn’t it? Justifies the holocaust and other war crimes, invading others, as well as selling the country out just so they can claim to be doing what’s best to save it.

    Now, *that* is inverted morality. Alex.

    I love this country of ours, and so I am a patriot (of sorts). And so I abide by the law and do not claim what is not mine. (Unlike those totally corrupt in power who line their pockets and act out of self-interest; out of a love of *true patriotism*.

    In other words, I do more than just rant and spend my time complaining and blaming, and doing little to change anything as you are so fond of doing.

    But then you are a *true patriot*, aren’t you?

  27.  Ha! Quite possibly. But perhaps he is more like one of those small cogs that constantly turns within a broken CD player? As there are a few teeth missing in the cog it perpetually slips and has to play again …

    and again …

    and again.

    “Lying leftist troll.”

    “Lying leftist troll.”

    “Lying leftist troll.”

    “Communist Syriza fanatics…”

    “Communist Syriza fanatics…”

    “Communist Syriza fanatics…”

    “Lying leftist troll”

    “anarchists”  “anarchists”  “anarchists”

    “tax evading poor” “tax evading poor” “tax evading poor”

    “I want Samaras to take me in an unnatural way…
     because I like the way he shafts us.”

    “I want Samaras to take me in an unnatural way…
     because I like the way he shafts us.”

    “I want Samaras to take me in an unnatural way…
     because I like the way he shafts us.”

    “FYROM” “FYROM” “FYROM”

    “Lying leftist troll”

    “FYROM”

    Note: anyone interested in buying the rights to this crappy rap? You’d make a fortune, really.

    You could then be charitable and donate some of the profit to Alex so he could find a quiet corner of Siberia all for himself where he can happily amuse himself singing it to his heart’s content.

  28. And you keep ranting about me without explain what am I saying wrong. You are such a moron you think you are “above’ left and right… when meanwhile you are just another whining leftist begging for money from the government.

    How exactly do yoy “help” Greece by begging for handouts while our government is crushed with debt comrade?

  29.  Begging for handouts from the government makes you a “patriot” dear?

    Do you actually believe your own stupidity you spoiled little child?

  30. blah blah blah is about the depth of your commentary comrade.

    How much money did you beg for from the government today? Did you throw any rocks at police? Firebomb any banks? Any cheering for leftist terrorist attacks like Syriza supporter “world arts”?

    Keep up the great work “helping” our country.

  31. What are you his girlfriend? How about saying something about policy dear-ski. Perhaps you can explain to us how ranting for handouts “helps” Greece?

  32. You claim you are an employer. I find it highly dubious. I on the other hand am self-employed dear (in the technology sector where I likely make a far higher hourly wage than you comrade). This is how I know it is difficult to create wealth and how ever little bit of beuracracy can slow me down.

    All my family members are self-employed. Most of my close relatives are self-employed.

    Meanwhile we have to listen to leftist parasites like you blame us for your own inability to feed yourselves.

    Lets get something straight comrade. Even with all the curruption in Greece,
    the poor you and leftist whiners like Syriza like to go on and on about… .are STILL MOSTLY TO BLAME FOR THEIR PROBLEMS.

    All you fricken leftists do is rant and rant how they are victims until they actually believe your stupidity.

     

  33.  About 50 percent of the people that call themselves Hellenes are Greeks. The other 50 percent’s really identity is their modern political ideologies. Greek, Arab, Chinese, Pakistani, Ethopian, Slavic… its all the same to them. They are in the process of deleting the Greek identity and being assimilated into other nationalities because they either simply don’t care enough about preserving hellenism or are such anti-nationalist extremists they reach the point they are racist towards Greeks that do care.

    They believe by fighting Greeks that care about hellenism they are fighting “”nationalism”. The confuse extreme nationalism with moderate patroitism that is necessary for any group of people to live together in a nation. Nationalism is like gravity. People seek to form communities. It is natural human behavior to seek the interests of one’s homeland foremost. Nationalism will exist long past the time the bones of anti-nationalist fanatics turn into dust. All they are really accomplishing is just stepping off a cliff while pretending gravity doesn’t exist. The result of their empty narratives is not anti-gravity.

  34. You nearly blew the CD theory out of the water until you mentioned ranting for handouts. If you’d care to look back over your previous posts you would see where most of the ranting takes place. As far as saying something about policy goes, what’s the point? Having seen your answers to other reasonable posts, it’s not policy ideas you want, just a chance to attack and abuse people. Girlfriend??? No, but it did get me thinking about how you could possibly have one. The idea of relaxing while listening to a CD has taken on a new meaning. Poor girl, if she exists.

  35. You rants against me are flattering but only demonstrate you have nothing of value to say.

    Are you Greek dear-ski?  Perhaps you are one of the manipulative Skopian fascists that occasionally come to Greek Reporter… pretending ot be Greek… then going on to cheer on communist Syriza?

    The Skopians really love Syriza (along with the KKE) Of course in their own country they vote for far right
    nationalist extremists like Gruevski.

  36. I really wouldn’t bother to have a rational dialogue with Alex the idiot. He is incapable of it.

    As his memory recall is non-existent asking him to formulate an opinion one can productively reason with is out of the question.

    Notice how you are instantly branded  a leftist or something else. (A Skopian fascist?! Not heard that before. Well, at least it is something different I suppose.)

    The poor idiot (or machine – no one can say for certain) that is Alex is simply an anal-retentive jerk.

  37.  No Alex, you are a loser.

    *I* very much doubt what you say about your working background as everything else you say is simply self-righteous crap. Also, why should I believe anything you say when you refuse to take what others tell you in good faith about their working lives?

    In short, you don’t do anything for a living, do you my dear Alex the loser?

    In fact, I think you are living a delusional existence and are really one of those whom you continually attack for being a leftist-scrounger.

    Long live Alex the leftist!

  38. You are such a clueless ranting troll you didn’t even notice you were being played by a Skopian pretending to be Greek.

    Here is the thead of other Greeks to see your stupidity in action.

    https://greece.greekreporter.com/2013/01/18/syriza-spokesman-says-venizelos-big-liar/

    How is your manipulative Skopian ally that pretended to be Greek but referenced Macedonia as  “aegean Macedonia”?

    I normal Greek concerned about his country would wonder if he’s still posting on this forum under different alias. They would wonder how many other websites and and how many other false flag Skopians are out there.

    You on the other hand try to evade?

  39. Sure buddy. I complain about leftist extremism. This clearly makes me a leftist. Meanwhile you complain about me complaining about leftist extremism.. and you are not a leftist.

    You are just like Aristotle. A marvel of logic.

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